(Gelöst) Nivona CafeRomatica NICR 831 - no milk frother, only steam

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    • (Gelöst) Nivona CafeRomatica NICR 831 - no milk frother, only steam

      Hersteller: Nivona | Typ-/Modell: CafeRomatica NICR 831 | ca. Baujahr: 2014

      Hi all,

      Hopefully it would be alright to ask a question about a technical problem in English, since I'm from Denmark, and would take ages for me to write in German (even though I do understand most written)
      Just a short intro to my equipment:
      1. Nivona 831 year 2014, brewed about 15.600 cups of coffee (!!). Bought used before I knew about asking about the statistics for the machine. However, it works great and makes great Cappucinos, which I love - we only drink Cappucinos here. I was told that the mechanical parts would likely to be replaced after 12-15000 cups, so when I saw another used Nivona (same model and year) but only 5600 cups, I bought it: So that's machine 2:
      2. Nivona 831, year 2014, brewed about 5600 cups, and only 200 of those with milk. PROBLEM: Milk frothering does not work. It was sold with the words 'works perfectly, bla bla' - but when I received it I was disappointed to learn that almost only steam came out when frothering the milk.
      The seller asked me to do a milk cleaning, which made it work for one cup, but now it doesn't work again.

      I have a video of the behavior here: Making hot milk

      And two more of the milk cleaning program. One with Nivona 1 (OK) and the other one Not OK (Nivona 2)
      Nivona 1 - OK
      Nivona 2 - Not OK

      I have been in contact with the local service center, they are suspecting the cheramic valve even though it has not been brewing that many cups. But I can also read from other threads here, that the drainage valve could be the problem?
      Can anyone point me in a direction? The good thing is, that I have a machine that is working, so I can compare different parts of the machine, and even swap them for testing - I just need to know what to look for :)
      I'm not afraid of taking the things apart, as long as I can put it back together :)

      Lastly - could this problem arise all of a sudden without the seller not being aware of this? (I does brew normal coffee correct, I feel)

      Thanks in advance, hope you can help!

      Mechanische Kenntnisse vorhanden: NEIN | Elektrische Kentnisse vorhanden: JA | Messgerät vorhanden: JA
    • Thanks for the quick answer!
      The number 2 Nivona has never used water filter as far as I can see on the stats, but has been regularly descaled for every 100 cups. But it's often better to use water filter, I heard. That way the calcified water would not reach the components inside the machine?

      I removed the cover from the drip tray, and held a screwdriver to the microswitch on the left side. BUT - demo effect: this time it made perfect milk 5 times in a row!

      I will try tomorrow again.
      What should I look for, if it behaves weird again?
    • Water filters are pretty crap. It's much better to save the money and just descale regularly.

      As your milk is not pumped (sucked) properly, the machine doesn't deliver enough steam pressure to the nozzle..
      So the steam either gets lost somewhere due to a leak ore something in the steam path is clogged.

      Did you already interchange the milk nozzle and hose between both machines?
    • Yes, forgot to mention what I had already tried:
      • Running all cleaning programs - descale, cleaning tab i coffee compartment and milk cleaning with hose in cleaning fluid
      • Swappped the nozzle and hose from nr 1 to nr 2 Nivona
      • Cleaned the nozzle and hose on the nr 2 Nivona.
      None of these things worked.

      So this morning, it went back to the old habit: Milk frothering without front cover

      When looking inside, it seems the only difference is some dripping on the tray on the left side.
    • Could that explain the errattic behavior - sometimes working, sometimes not?
      I guess I would need to follow this guide to disassemble and clean?
      Drainageventil ausbauen - ersetzen - tauschen - einbauen

      It looks like it's pretty much work to get inside - would I be better off just to order the replacement part and just replace it while I'm at it? Or is it fairly easy just to get it out and rinse it.
    • Ok, thanks I will look at it.

      As I just had some time before leaving for work, I took off the cap behind the brewing unit to uncover the drainage valve. As seen on the pictures, one of the screws was badly rusted, so was very hard to remove.
      Once the cover was off, there was a lot of old coffe around the drainage valve. I have removed most of it, but would be better to clean the whole valve.
      But I will start off with your suggestion on the outlet valve (Auslauf ventil).

      Will report back with my findings.
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    • I have managed to disassemble the top and sides. If the black valve (IMG_2569) is the 'auslaufventil' - then it does not look worn or damaged. I have also unscrewed the ceramic valve which also looks nice and not calcified.
      Do I need to take all the wires off the PCB to get it off and get to the valve behind it, in order to unmount and clean it?

      How do I access and clean the drainage valve - it seems I need to get it out from the side with the PCB, which I guess means that I need to take almost all wires off the board?

      For me the most dirty component is the drainage valve, I would like to clean it if possible.
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    • Correct, image 2569 shows the Auslaufventil (AV).
      Usually it's sufficient to just remove the screws from the PCB and move it slightly outboard.

      For the drain valve I would just unplug the connector of the drive (third from left on top on PCB) and split the red-black power cable of the drive. Disconnect the water hose left of the AV and remove the AV together with the drive after removing all screws from the brewing unit side.

      If you decide to remove the PCB completely, just a good advice: Take pictures! Better more than less.
    • Ok,
      So I took some of the cables off the PCB (made notes, but good point - images are very good in these situations! :) ), so that I could get to the AV and take it out. Looked very nice, but disassembled, cleaned and put new grease on the O-rings and the stud inside the valve. Reassembled again.

      I'll try your suggestion about the drain valve.

      After I have cleaned the components, will there be an advantage in trying out the machine before reassembling it? Maybe for documenting if some things are still wrong?
      Bilder
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    • Before reassembling the AV, stretch the spring just slightly. Maybe 2 to 3 mm. Not too much as it might not open anymore.

      You need to reassemble the machine to a certain extent before you can run it more or less properly. You could keep the rear cover removed. If you keep the top cover removed, you need to put a magnet on the reed sensor for the powder lid and also keep the switch for the bean lid pressed. So installing the top cover is usually the faster way.
    • So - to sum up what I did:
      • Cleaned drainage valve, took it apart, new grease and reassembled (there was A LOT of old coffee grounds stuck to the surroundings)
      • Cleaned expansion chamber (the one connected to the drainage valve)
      • Took the AV apart, cleaned, stretched the spring a little bit, grease and reassembled
      • Reassembled
      I have not tested and compared to my working Nivona. The first test was not succesful, but the next three were very nice.
      I hope it has solved the issue, I'm just uncertain if I again just experienced the demo effectt where it works, but then stops later or tomorrow.
      Anyway, I have learned a lot taking the machine apart and I'm not afraid to dig in another time if it stops working.

      I will report back here during the next days, so that my results are known.
      Thanks alot for the help so far!!
    • So - as partly expected, the faulty behavior resumed a few hours later. So nothing has really changed, apart from the fact that is is now pretty clean inside.

      So what's the reason for this behavior? Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't?
      What parts can I try to swap from the working Nivona to this one? Maybe try the easiest swaps first :
      1. Ceramic valve - I guess this would be the complete unit including motor
      2. Auslauf Ventil
      3. Drainage valve
      Any suggestions?
    • Check again, if there is still water dripping into the tray when you select milk.
      If that's the case, it's definitely the AV.

      I had a similar case some time ago with a Melitta Caffeo CI. Sometimes it worked, sometimes not. This machine drove me crazy over some weeks.

      In the end it turned out, that the new purchased and installed AV was faulty.
    • I compared the two machines again, trying to make some frothered milk (using water instead).
      Generally I did not see that many drops of water, but what really stood out was the amount of steam coming out by the drainage valve on the one where it does not frother properly:
      Milk Frothering - OK
      Milk Frothering - NOT OK

      Still convinced that it is the AV ? Then will try to swap them tomorrow.

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 1 mal editiert, zuletzt von carstenpanch ()

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